Head gasket - VVC - go twice

[AlanG]

Hi

I am looking at an 04 VVC engined S2. The head gasket was replaced in 2019. Do they fail more than once? Does it depend on who did it and how it was done?

Thank you 

[DeanB]

I would say they don't fail again if the work is done properly and a modern gasket is used. Maybe it will say on the service history who did it?

 

[AlanG]

Thank you, Dean. It was done by an Elise specialist, Simon Scott Russell.

[Elisemadray]

Simon is usually very thorough

[winthattt]

I would not worry as even if it did go, it’s not a super expensive fix.  I was talking to my lotus specialist and he said he has not done a HG in a long time.  Only exception is the VHPD engines, you can’t get heads for them.

[AlanG]

Thank you for your comments. Much appreciated.

[DeanB]

Simon Scott Russell has a first class reputation and knows Elises inside out and back to front. If he did it it will be fine.

[AlanG]

Thank you Dean.

[Georgep100]

Hello Alan. 
 

If you have repeat failure of head gasket it’s not likely to be fixed by a multi layer steel head gasket or good workmanship. It could be that the liners have sunk below the deck of the block. They are meant to stand proud of the deck to help create a good seal between cylinder and gasket. 
 

Ultimately the failsafe solution is new liners/bottom end rebuild, updated oil rail (not essential apparently, I did it anyway) higher torque head bolts and head saver shim to preserve the cyl head. Alternatively keep changing head gasket every 5000 miles. 

 Cheers 

[DeanB]

1 hour ago, Georgep100 said:

Hello Alan. 
 

If you have repeat failure of head gasket it’s not likely to be fixed by a multi layer steel head gasket or good workmanship. It could be that the liners have sunk below the deck of the block. They are meant to stand proud of the deck to help create a good seal between cylinder and gasket. 
 

Ultimately the failsafe solution is new liners/bottom end rebuild, updated oil rail (not essential apparently, I did it anyway) higher torque head bolts and head saver shim to preserve the cyl head. Alternatively keep changing head gasket every 5000 miles. 

 Cheers 

George I'm sure all of that will make it bomb proof but mine has been just fine without a bottom end rebuild and Gav at Unit 4 has done dozens without further failures. As you say, liner heights need to be in tolerance and Gav always has the head skimmed to be sure it's nice and flat. If the head isn't weakened or damaged it's fine to simply refit with a MLS gasket and new oem stretch bolts.

I wouldn't want to frighten people in to thinking a blown head gasket will always require a full bottom end rebuild and new liners at a cost of about three grand.

[Georgep100]

No scare mongering here, just a reality for some.

Yes head skimming is usually always done as you can’t risk it being an aluminium head, but can’t be skimmed endlessly, they have a limit. Worth remembering after every skim the compression ratio will increase and the cam timing will be retarded circa 1 degree every mm taken off.

In fairness, it seems the blocks themselves weren’t perfect from Rover hence why liner shims were manufactured to help lift them. But if you’re getting into liner shims we just thought it would be better to do the whole thing. 
 

I’d genuinely love to know the longevity of mine (I’ll find out one day) compared to slapping MLS and forgetting about it. Would have saved us many weekends work 😂

 

 

 

[DeanB]

I don't dispute a lot more work is required if the liner heights are out of tolerance. They won't lift themselves up will they? 🙂

Luckily for me my liner heights were fine.

[Georgep100]

That’s good, glad Gav sorted it for you! 

[Martin R]

A small tale. I had a Rover 45 off a gentleman on here very cheap as the HG was gone. I needed a run about whilst waiting on an insurance claim after someone wrote off our Fiesta.

Upon lifting the head the liners were flat to the block height. I slapped a good payen gasket on, had the head skimmed and crossed my fingers.

It lasted 1k miles and let go in rather spectacular fashion outside work. I purchased a Chinese multi layer gasket. Lifted the head and slapped that on.

It was still going strong 10k miles later when i let it go to a friend. He had a few more years of service out of it. It was a proper SAIC gasket on not one of many knock off ones. Make of that what you will.