Newbie question

[Andy wright]

First trip out. Just to check that nothing was going to fall off. The good news. The suspension is an order of magnitude better. No more banging and crashing every time any wheel even thought about venturing near a hole in the road. Next, the car went in a straight line and went where I pointed it.So far so good.The bad bits. The steering wheel was now way off centre, but given that I discovered that the steering arm/ track rod end combination were not equal length on each side when I stripped them down, and now they are, something had to give. Next, my very careful glued on rear view mirror holder clip lasted about 3 seconds before giving in to gravity . And the worst bit? Brakes were shite . The cause is air, as a couple of rapid pedal pumps and they worked really well. But given that I pressure bled thoroughly ( or so I thought ) , back on stands next week and round two of brake bleeding . 

[Andy wright]

And the brake bleeding is a novel little task which centres on the design of the front calipers. The top feed to them makes bleeding potentially really tricky . Sometimes I guess folk get lucky but the remedy is to use a pressure bleeder, on really low pressure, then remove pads and put in some worn ones, press pedal and get the pistons to move out a bit. Then, unbolted the caliper , crack open the bleed nipple , invert the caliper and press in the inner piston. Then, turn the right way up, press in the outer piston , then close the bleed nipple . That worked. And I think I understand why.My radical solution was going to be to remove caliper and pistons and seals , machine off the AP logo on the back face, drill and tap to m10x1 and convert to side feed. The top feed would then be the bleed nipple for that piston , with the other one serving the outer piston. Several lotus race car owners have done that after spending hours trying to bleed the brakes after a hose replacement . 
 

Four wheel alignment and camber check next, then it’s fully operational apart from the hard top which is getting its lining replaced . That is, I am replacing the headlining and trying not to make a complete mess of it . 

[winthattt]

That’s the trick to bleeding the brakes, invert. I do it with an Eazibleed thingy. 
 

I bleed the brakes on my gt86 by opening all the bleed nipples, top up fluid, have a cup of tea -done!

[Andy wright]

That is how it should be. Bonkers design caliper .

[Andy wright]

Headlining now done.I am not sure that the Bentley upholstery department will be on the phone to me on Monday morning begging  me to join their team, but it is better than it was before ( it was falling off so the bar was set pretty low) . I have also reset the camber having been for a 4 wheel alignment and discovered that the camber was not quite where I thought it was( read ‘ a mile off’ ) so the alignment is on hold until I can get a slot next week. 

[Andy wright]

Alignment now done. Hardtop reinstated . Just the diffuser to re fit and I can put my spanners away . 
list of things that I would like to change but not at the moment as the car has already absorbed too much cash.

(1) Paintwork.,particularly the doors 

(2) Exhaust. Pretty crusty. A Larini or Hangar 111 would be nice 

(3) Brakes. They work well, but the pedal travel is a bit more than I would like and I am unconvinced with the servo. It works , but on a car this light , I am not sure why Lotus started to fit one , presumably when they went Toyota . A properly set up pedal box with the correct choice of master cylinders and Calipers gives a brilliant pedal feel, nice short travel and wonderful progression. 

[DeanB]

47 minutes ago, Andy wright said:

Alignment now done. Hardtop reinstated . Just the diffuser to re fit and I can put my spanners away . 
list of things that I would like to change but not at the moment as the car has already absorbed too much cash.

(1) Paintwork.,particularly the doors 

(2) Exhaust. Pretty crusty. A Larini or Hangar 111 would be nice 

(3) Brakes. They work well, but the pedal travel is a bit more than I would like and I am unconvinced with the servo. It works , but on a car this light , I am not sure why Lotus started to fit one , presumably when they went Toyota . A properly set up pedal box with the correct choice of master cylinders and Calipers gives a brilliant pedal feel, nice short travel and wonderful progression. 

Sounds to me you should have bought a K series Elise!

 

[Andy wright]

18 minutes ago, DeanB said:

Sounds to me you should have bought a K series Elise!

 

Yup. With hindsight. The snag was that I had a part ex so finding a dealer who had an Elise and was happy to part ex the R32 limited my choice . The paintwork and the exhaust are just one of those things. And the 1ZZ engine, though no fireball , is easy to live with . Re engineering the brakes is a bit more of a challenge. As the abs is front / rear split it is possible to retain it and still use a pedal box and two master cylinders . The harder bit is the pedal and servo . Without pulling the whole lot out I am not quite sure what type of box would fit, how to get close to 6:1 pedal ratio etc. It will be doable but not for today . 

[DeanB]

Sounds like a lot of hassle. That sort of thing would also make it hard to sell on when the time comes. 

It's a bit odd but people don't mind early modded Elises but you don't see many heavily modded Toyota Elises. I can only speculate as to why that is.

A lot of MLOCers that have the 1ZZ Elise have been very happy with them. If driven competently they can easily keep up on the Sunday morning runs (which you should absolutely do by the way).

[winthattt]

My S2 Exige had excellent brakes, servo and an abs which would not kill you (vx220). I used high temp fluid (Millers) and Pagid blue pads. 

[Andy wright]

Thanks gents. The braking is indeed very good. It’s the pedal travel that I am not keen on. I have Mintex 1144 all round on e.o discs . No real complaints about the pads. I think I may have a bit of pad knock back on the front. I will set up my dial gauge and check the front rotor run-out . That might just be the problem but as there is no vibration when the brakes are applied, I may be clutching at straws. And yes, keen to get out on a Sunday drive, now I have a car to go in! 

[Guido]

7 hours ago, DeanB said:

A lot of MLOCers that have the 1ZZ Elise have been very happy with them. If driven competently they can easily keep up on the Sunday morning runs (which you should absolutely do by the way).

I echo Deans comments. I had a S2 1ZZ and you could drive flat out without worrying about killing yourself!  Not the case with my S3 Exige 😬

[Oakman]

1 hour ago, Guido said:

I echo Deans comments. I had a S2 1ZZ and you could drive flat out without worrying about killing yourself!  Not the case with my S3 Exige 😬

Just wait till you get in one of these - you have to release the air brakes to keep up !

 

[Lithopsian]

Pedal travel isn't the first thing most people think of when trying to improve the brakes on the Elise.  Is it the travel to the initial bite point?  Is the pushrod adjusted correct;y?  Or travel after the initial bite?

The S1 calipers came with anti-knock-back springs, but I think they were dropped on the S2.  Not sure if they came back on some of the later track-oriented cars.

[Andy wright]

Thanks for,your observations. Travel to initial bite is the problem. You are correct on the anti knock back springs. No sign of them in my Calipers. Which is part of the issue. The other one , which I need to check, is the pushrod adjustment. It may be that I have too much free movement there, which is the root cause of my ‘ problem’ . Once the brakes start to bite , they are very good. I will check said pushrod as that may be the issue.

 Cheers,