Downgrading...?

[MattyB]

No, not to an S2 ... haha Well, at least I'm not downgrading THAT far

 

 

Thinking about trying to find someone who is interested in upgrading from a base 120 S1 to a Sport160, so we'd swap.

 

The reason is this - my 160 is wasted on me (no comments!) because I'm not using the benefits of it by going on track. A base S1 would be far, far better for me, and I could then free up a few grand to allow me to buy a MK1 Golf GTI (Ladders ) for my everyday car, and maybe pay off some of the loan.

 

What do you reckon? Would I be dissapointed with a 120 ? Would I end up spending the difference on upgrades to try and make up for the loss of 40bhp?

 

Never really driven a 120 (properly) so I don't know, although I always remember reading that the base Elise - compared to a 160 - was "70% of the price for 95% of the fun"

 

Comments?

[steve]

How many miles has yours done matty? and what do you think its worth?

[MattyB]

Done 17.5k miles.

 

I honestly don't know Steve. Its got FLSH upto now (Willaims in Bristol), and I'm due to have it serviced soon - probably with Horizon. Geo'd and new tyres only a few weeks back...De-cat, single airbox plus all the optional sports bits (Janspeed, LSS and Radio kit)

 

Its never been tracked - infact, its never seen a hard say in its life. I've only really used it to get me to and from work. Previous owner was a SAAB dealer so his girlfriend used to drive it to pose in down the shops.

 

Originally, I was going to ask £16,800ish, in the hope of getting £16.5, but now I'll be looking to get about £16k, as the prices seem to be coming down a bit. I'd probably be looking at a 120 plus £3k, or thereabouts.

 

 

Thats if I decide to go down that path!

[steve]

What do you reckon for mine?

 

52k miles but with the 160 LAD upgraded head, induction, sports ex, etc etc.

 

only ideas at this stage though eh!?!

[JohnnyM]

Matty

 

Keep the 160, nothing else will do.

 

John

[GCCK]

I disagree Johnny.

 

Don't be swayed by the bravado, Matty, there's cash at stake! Think it's a very sensible and mature idea if you don't feel you're getting full value out of it. And then there's the insurance...

 

Also, it's quite a timely decision: S160's are almost a fashion item at the moment with the values at a good premium to the more basic versions. The pendulum is as likely to swing the other way - as folks stop seeing it as the ultimate S1 but start to complain about the things that are wrong with it (lumpy idle, starting etc.). Besides, it's not really "ultimate" any more - S2 and Nitron suspension is streets ahead of the Koni LSS the S160 gets, and the PTP170 engine has more power & torque yet still knows how to behave.

 

Have a look at some std S1's and pick a good one - regardless of age - which has been well maintained and (soap-box at the ready) had the important things brought up to date: suspension, clutch trunnion, gear linkage, hoses all sorted and a decent set of tyres. As I've just proved the difference between a car with those things fixed and one that hasn't can be £2,500 although I wouldn't expect that to be realised as full resale value. If you do it right, you'll be able to sell on the S160 to someone who doesn't know about such things and buy a good S1 from someone who does!

 

Graeme

[Scott_Mac]

It isn't a bad idea at all Matty.... you are welcome to try mine out and see how it goes in comparison.

 

I reckon what you are doing is a good plan, but make sure the std car is a good one, like Graeme says, that has had the basics sorted. I have spent a fair whack on mine as you know, but hopefully there shouldn't be much else to go wrong on it!

 

Like you say though, they are a fashion item and on the road 70% of price for 95% of fun is probably accurate.... i don't think i would change to a 160 i have to say.

 

Is now a good time to say what i did before you bought yours, about buying a std car

[MattyB]

Well I don't reckon I'd have many problems finding someone willing to swap.

 

Loads of em on SELOC go on about upgrading to a 160 - but p/x for one means dealer trade in price and dealer purchase prices. Buying private means the hassle of selling, then trying to find a 160....

 

Giving someone the option of a "part exchange" but at private prices ... must be tempting although everyone will probably be suspicious as to why I'm doing it!

 

We'll see anyway....I'd have to get it service'd and MOTted first though...

[Scott_Mac]

Well the offers there if you want to try a mildly modded S1.

 

What you say makes sense though... i'm sure WillB would be interested!

[MattyB]

The way the S2 prices are, I could do a straight swap for one of them

 

...

 

...

 

*comes to senses*

I'm sorry, drifted away for a second then

[Scott_Mac]

<slap>

 

Did that help?

[JohnnyM]

nah, i had a std s1 which had all the "jobs" done on it as you describe, s2 dampers, clutch trunion, clutch hose, gear linkage, advans etc....

 

the s160 has a lumpy idle, but i wouldnt call it a problem, its just part of its character. In my experience the starting problem is a myth, mine starts every time and is perfectly drivable from 1500 rpm onwards nothing like the reports i'd heard.

 

I agree the Koni LSS isnt upto Nitron standards, but if as Matty says he isnt pushing the car, he's not going to lose sleep over that aspect.

 

You'd have to upgrade the seats too as the std seats are very poor by comparison (111s and Corbeau's excepted). From a GJOB perspective the wheels arent quite as nice either on the std car....

 

The insurance on the 160 costs me a whopping £100 a year extra a whole £8.34 a month!

 

I can accept going to a PTP170 or something like that since from an engine perspective its at least as good if not better than the 160, but if a PTP170 is better, those owners won't be queuing up to swap with Matty. I also think a factory model will be easier to sell on than a PTP type aftermarket model, unless there is still a demand from the enthusiast community when you decide to get rid.

 

I personally wouldnt dub the 160 a fashion item, surely that crown goes to the std s2s that can be had for the same money. more plush inside, and a newer shape and big understeer all as standard!

 

I am admittedly slightly biased here, but having had both cars i can categorically state that IMHO a std s1. is defintely not better than a 160 and going back to a std s1 would IMHO be a frustrating experience unless you have a wedge of cash to upgrade it, by which time you'll wonder why you started off on this road.

 

All IMHO of course

 

Johnny M

[GCCK]

Interesting feedback Johnny - the more valuable for you having owned both. Suppose the distinction is that you went from std to S160 and found what you wanted. Matty's dilemma is that he's not sure S160 is what he wants or needs.

 

My points about the upgrade options are exactly that: options. There's no obligation to upgrade at all, but at least when inclination and funds are available, the owner can select from the best on offer at the time.

 

From a value perspective, Matty needn't be limited to a MY2000 car with a std S1 and could therefore find a much cheaper car than his S160.

 

Graeme

[malbon]

Why are you all arguing about these inferior models ??

 

If you want instant driveability as standard then its gotta be..

[Kris H]

Very nice Jon. What are you going to do about the plates? You might get a few quid by selling that one if you were going to put your own one back on.

 

FWIW it seems like a good plan to me Matty and might make day to day running a bit easier for you since you seem to have had more than your share of hassles.