1.8 Turbo Audi,skoda,vw Engine

[tazbaz69]

ok i was wondering if anyone knew much regards to these engines and how difficult there are to fit in elise?? i noticed a few ppl doing conversions on them and was wondering on process and want sort of power gains u expect to get over standard elise??

[Steve J]

One of the guys on SELOC has done it and I think he is very pleased with the result.

[Mark H]

http://www.auto-teknix.co.uk/index.htm

 

Thats the website your after, plenty of stats on there, Bernard is the man to sort you out

[Scott_Mac]

Base spec he is getting 250bhp and similar torque... that costs £7k fitted.

 

Bernard (the guy doing it) isn't just "some guy" though, he is a bit of a genius and has done an awful lot of work with Elises.. i don't believe it is a straightforward swap, different engine mounts, cooling is a prob etc, extra weight to compensate for.

 

It is achievable, but i doubt its easy.

[Mark H]

As posted by Jas to the EliseTT group the other day:

 

 

 

The Car?

 

I wonder how many different engines can now be found in the Lotus

Elise. There are variously modified K Series cars with normally

aspirated conversions and also supercharged versions (TT). We have

since seen very high powered and very expensive conversions such as

the Elise Esthi with its massively powerful 400bhp engine, with a

960kg price to pay (417bhp/ton).

 

To put this into context, an Esthi has superior power to weight to a

Caterham Superlight R with its 400bhp/ton, or a Porsche 911 Turbo and

GT3 with around 270bhp/ton, or even a GT2 with 340bhp/ton. It's only

just beaten by the Carrera GT supercar with 438bhp/ton and the Pagani

Zonda though with 444bhp/ton. A McLaren F1 of course develops an

unbeatable 570bhp/ton! So, the Esthi is in supercar territory albeit

not at the top of the tree.

 

There are also much more reasonably priced (£10k) conversions than

the Esthi such as the Honda [see SELOC for my review], and the Ford

Duratech. Now there's another contender for the throne, with

Bernard's Audi engine conversion! This conversion makes 250bhp and a

massive 260lb/ft torque in its lowest power configuration!

 

Bernard's car is an S1 Elise, and has S2 LSS fitted but was running

on Toyos. The install was his prototype and is therefore still

subject to some tweaking. For example, the gearbox has overly long

ratios sourced from a diesel vehicle.

 

 

 

 

Shhhh…..Quiet!

 

The first thing I noticed was that the car is very quiet; strangely

quiet for an Elise. There is none of the noise or frantic activity

of most high power modifications, making the car very relaxing. The

most prominent sound is in fact the sound of the turbo spinning and

the dump valve venting air. It feels and sounds quite similar to a

Noble M12 in this respect. In fact the power delivery is very

similar, except with one major difference – but more on that later.

 

The power is delivered in a smooth manner, with lots of low down

torque, although the engine runs out of torque at higher revs.

Bernard said this was a characteristic of the 250bhp conversion, and

the 300bhp conversion does not behave this way.

 

The car feels very much like a Grand Tourer.

 

 

 

 

 

How Quick?

 

The car is deceptively fast. Whereas a Honda Elise lets you know in

no uncertain terms just how quickly it's going, the Audi Elise

deceives you. Without realising it you will reach triple digits,

very quietly and very quickly.

 

This does however make it impossible to compare its performance with

other conversions. It feels quick, but I'd guess no faster than my

TT and possibly a bit slower. BUT, Bernard reckons it's quicker than

a TT230 he drove, and to be fair the 250bhp & 260lb/ft torque suggest

it will be quicker. AND I was very mistaken, when after test-driving

the Honda I wrongly thought it was faster than the TT.

 

My conclusion is that you simply can't tell which is quicker in a

back-to-back test drive between cars where the power is delivered in

such different ways. It requires a head-to-head test.

 

I also wonder how much faster the Audi Elise would have felt with

better gearing.

 

I should also mention, that just like the Honda conversion I tested,

the gearshift mechanism needs further development. The gearshift

felt vague and woolly in comparison with a standard K Series or

Toyota Elise. This is however something I'm sure any owner would

quickly get used to.

 

 

 

 

Yes But It Weighs A Ton!

 

Well no, not quite. Yes it's an iron block engine and as such, 50kg

heavier than the K Series, but the extra weight also provides much

greater durability and strength. There are cars running these at

375bhp without problems (the most powerful conversion having 392bhp

and 345lb/ft). Furthermore, I couldn't feel the additional weight in

driving the car, unlike with the VX Turbo where its weight was quite

evident.

 

So, a phenomenal amount of power, yet still a very significantly

lighter car than the VX Turbo or Noble M12.

 

 

 

 

Two Dirty Words!

 

No, not Porsche Boxster! Turbo lag!! Is there any? Well yes there

is, but it is very slight and is on a par with the VX Turbo, as

opposed to the Noble M12, which suffers from very significant lag.

Like the VX Turbo, you have to look for the lag to notice it and even

then only at low engine speeds. At mid-high engine speeds there's

virtually no lag.

 

 

 

 

How Much?

 

In value for money terms it's pretty much unbeatable. You can have a

300bhp conversion for £7,500 all inclusive, or a 250bhp conversion

for less.

 

 

 

 

 

How Fast Do You Want To Go?

 

See the power curves for the difference between the 250bhp and 300bhp

versions. The 330bhp version will be better still of course.

Bernard provided the following data to demonstrate the increase in

peak torque at the wheels between his 250bhp car (with long ratios)

and Matt's correctly geared 300bhp (725kg) Exige. Yes, the 300bhp

Audi Exige has the SAME power to weight ratio as the Esthi supercar,

yet is much cheaper and lighter, therefore handling better!

 

 

Gear 300 BHP car

1st 36%

2nd 47%

3rd 57%

4th 70%

5th 72%

6th 68%

 

 

Clearly this data suggests that the 300bhp car will be in a different

league to the one I tested, and I would suggest it would annihilate

any Honda, even a supercharged one, and also any TT conversion. The

idea of a 330bhp Audi conversion simply leaves me drooling!

 

 

 

 

What About The Others?

 

Any of the Honda, TT or Audi conversions will easily outperform the

factory Toyota engined S2 111R or Exige. The Audi is additionally a

more relaxed car to drive.

 

The Honda conversion feels like the racer it is, and lets you know in

no uncertain terms how fast it is. It's an ideal conversion for

those whose focus is the track. Because of the nature of its power

delivery, it's also the one with the widest grin factor. It should

also be a reliable engine.

 

Close behind in grin factor, and with a fairly similar feel, is the

TT conversion. A TT230 doesn't feel as fast, yet will out accelerate

a Honda. In terms of power delivery and feel, it is very close to a

normal K Series car except with lots more torque and an engine that

wants to keep revving and giving ever-increasing power. The TT is an

ideal conversion for road use.

 

The Audi conversion is very different in feel to the others, offering

a much more relaxed drive in a car that is quiet and deceptively

quick. Technically, given its power output even the lowest power

variant should out-accelerate both the other conversions, given

appropriate gearing. The more powerful Audi's should simply

annihilate the other conversions in performance terms. I would also

expect the engine to be similarly reliable to the Honda, if not more

so due to it's far lower revving nature. Hence, this conversion

really depends on your own criteria, but should be equally at home on

road or track.

 

 

 

Summary

 

In summary, the Audi conversion is very different from the others and

is excellent value for money. However, all three conversions are so

different from each other that anyone considering an upgrade really

must test drive all of them to see how well each of them meets their

own criteria for a car. If it's pure performance or value for money

you seek though, then the Audi is the clear leader.

 

 

 

 

 

The so called "Secret" Project: "R500"

 

A few people have queried what my "secret project" is, and many of

you have correctly guessed it involves an Audi engine.

 

Well, it's not part of the review, but reading the above should make

it pretty clear what the car project I am evaluating involves.

 

It involves an Audi 350bhp engine in an Elise. I'm evaluating the

feasibility and cost of building an Elise that has a 350bhp engine,

yet weighs a maximum of 700kg. Turbo Technics may have to get

involved to push the turbo to provide that level of power though, but

they are literally 10 minutes from Bernard. The target objective

being an Elise with at least 500bhp/ton! Given I don't really want

to own two Elises, it'll probably be an S1 Exige, hence my project

name is "Exige R500".

 

The 500bhp/ton is a "hard target", in that this target MUST be met if

I decide to proceed with the project. I won't compromise on the

power or weight.

 

I'll post more details if and when I decide to proceed.

[AndyD]

If you search around Exiges.com you will see quite some talk on the Audi conversion along with some interesting Video of Matt Cummings Elise - outrunning a Radical ...

[Foley]

Bernard (the guy doing it) isn't just "some guy" though, he is a bit of a genius and has done an awful lot of work with Elises..

I'm pretty sure Bernard was on the development team of ThrustII

[GCCK]

Bernard took his car to the PTP rolling road day earlier this year, and came out on the early bit of the run afterwards. That thing absolutely flies - looks like an ordinary S1 apart from the Exige wheels.

 

Notably, there is no mention of how you stop a beast like that...

[Scott_Mac]

Parachute?