Sport 160 Ecu Questions!

[russelld]

Dave

 

The first photo shows my VHPD engine with the crank at TDC note the cam lock tool, you need this in place to undo the pulley bolts.

 

The second photo is with the bolts removed ( schoolboy error I marked the pulleys up wrong the one with IN tipexed on it is actually the exhaust cam ). If you compare these to the third image which shows how

a standard k series is timed you will see the difference.

 

The forth image shows a standard engine with the bolts removed and the last image shows the crank at TDC marks on the front bottom pulley, The mark is at the back of the pulley and can be difficult to find.

 

Looking at mine it appears that the exhaust pulley is standard and the inlet pulley has a third key way cut into it, not sure what yours will be like ? I now have 1444 cams with vernier pulleys on my engine so it is different again !

 

Russ.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Daveb99]

Thanks Russ, appreciate this - unfortunately it has confused me further though!!   I think I'm just a bit thick as far as these things go 

 

I'm looking for an easy way to see whether I have the standard S160 exhaust cam pulley (timed at 102 degrees) or the revised one as per the drivability kit (112

degrees).

 

Seems like I'll certainly need a cam lock tool before I can go any further anyway, but when I have, and with the pulley bolts removed to see the , my basic approach (and simple mind!) tells me that somehow with a protractor I could measure some angles and work it out???

 

Maybe I should go back to school and pay more attention in physics.   My German & Business degree has got me nowhere with this!

[russelld]

Dave

 

Sorry I have given you some wrong information. The cams are timed with the engine set at 90deg BTDC not at TDC as I previously posted. Here is an image which shows the timing marks for 90 BTDC.

 

[Daveb99]

Quick update on this....having been in touch again with the previous owner (Steve) who fitted the Emerald (who now has a lovely S2 Sport 190) we have pretty much deduced that the exhaust cam pulley is the revised one (from the Driveability upgrade) - there's no reason why anyone after that would remove it and put a standard one back on.

 

Steve even has the original ECU in his garage, which of course has the correct map on it (S160 Driveability upgrade map).  It unfortunately has a fault (blown IACV controller chip) but he has very kindly offered to send it to a place that specialise in EFi ECUs for them to transfer the map to the other (working) ECU that I've been offered (which most likely has the original S160 map on it).

 

Problem is - and it's a risk - if the original ECU from my car blew a controller chip, who's to say it won't happen again with the replacement one?   I guess I could keep my Emerald and refit it in the event that happens though.   

 

So, I need some steer here from fellow MLOCers - basically after paying for the map to be transferred, postage costs, and buying the working EFi ECU, I'm looking at £300+ I think.   This would give me originality, which helps with resale price if/when the time comes, and of course restore the lumpy idle to its full glory, pretty much (it reduces slightly with the Driveability upgrade due to the reduced inlet/exhaust cam overlap.

 

I think my idle is pretty characterful as it is - albeit different to the usual S160 "humph humph humph" mini race engine type idle.  I wouldn't mind people's opinions on it so I have a video clip which I'll add shortly.   I'm also hopefully bringing it to the MLOC meet at Shardlow tomorrow night so anyone going can hear it in the flesh - wish there was another S160 there to compare it with!

 

Still would like to give this a go as it could be one of those things that makes the car even more enjoyable - even the wife has given it the green light, which was somewhat unexpected 

 

EDIT - here's the video, plus one of an S160 with the driveability kit fitted (owner on SELOC pointed me at it!).

 

Opinions welcome - help me decide!!  Mine sounds a bit like it's farting because I think there's a slight hole in my flexi - another job - or it could just be that the Janspeed Roadsport is well known to be quite deep in pitch.    The titanium car is running a different exhaust of course, so sounds less deep - but you can hear the difference other than that.

 

Mine:  

 

The one with the full fat 'throbbing' idle:  

[jody391]

Dave my take on this is that they sound different due to the exhaust?

And does the "full fat version" have a de cat? Is it the same?

I wouldn't bother spending the cash.

[russelld]

Yours sounds lumpy to me Dave, as Jody has said different exhaust tone.

[Simon Mac]

Dave, I think yours sounds fine, but reading between the lines a little, it sounds like you have it in your head you want to do it.  (I get these projects in my head sometimes too, so know the feeling )

 

It's a £300 gamble, but you will probably see most of that back at some point, and learn a chunk of stuff in the process of doing it. So it's not all bad.

 

I would say now is probably not the right time of year to be doing it though, it will probably be fiddly, and take much longer than you think. (These things always do). Enjoy the car while the suns out, and do this sort of thing in the winter downtime.

[Daveb99]

Cheers for the replies again chaps, I realise this isn't exactly the most exciting thread

 

Jody/Russell - there's definitely a difference between the 'standard' S160 idle and mine, not just exhaust differences. Another clip to show this would be this one: http://youtu.be/GmggGpnVnGw

 

Simon - I think you're spot on there - I've always hankered after a standard ECU to restore the idle, and now one is available I've got the bit between my teeth. My wife knows it's easier to give in than start arguing the toss - I'm sure that's why she has been so compliant

 

It's like man maths - it often doesn't add up but the itch has to be scratched, otherwise it never goes away...

[AlanS1]

I also think it sounds nice and lumpy. 

The other one just has a louder and different exhaust note, but that could simply be down to make of exhaust etc.

 

Are you still running a Cat?

[Daveb99]

Yep, still running a Cat Alan. Three of our 4 immediate neighbours are elderly and we get on well with them

 

I can hear what you're saying re the lumpiness. Maybe I need to forget it and accept that mine is still mega :-)

[AlanS1]

I have a silenced decat that I will be selling. You are more than welcome to try it and return if it's not what you want or don't like it?

[Daveb99]

Cheers Alan - will give that some thought - which one is it, and what would the advantages be? Do you reckon it's any louder than running with cat on?

[Daveb99]

Things have moved forward....

 

Firstly for anyone in any doubt - this is the proper S160 idle - best clip yet

 

 

Had a chat to Dan Webster & I think I'll keep the Emerald, and fit verniers to adjust the timing - i.e. increase the cam overlap enough to give the 'pulsing' idle but not impact the driveability (it will be a slight compromise I guess) - Dan can do it all of course, including remapping my Emerald to suit, rolling road etc.

 

Having to match the S160 EFI ECU to my 5AS immobiliser unit has put me off going down that route - no one is sure whether it has to be done, or how to do it, plus I've been sent a clip of an S160 with the 'Driveability upgrade' and I'm not sure it is much lumpier than my current map/timing.

 

If I do then also go for one of Alan's CRP options, it should sound like quite a different beast...

 

Finally getting somewhere!

[Daveb99]

Quick update.....been to Alan's tonight to fit the silenced decat pipe he kindly offered. Has made a great difference, overall slightly louder (which I like) and it has brought out the character a fair bit too, I reckon the cat was masking it a bit. Feels a bit quicker too, for sure, and sounds like a mini racer at full chat

 

It may be enough for me to hold off on the timing changes, I will give it a few weeks.

 

Big thanks to Alan.....and I'll have it known that he was polishing his car when I arrived, mine on the other hand is filthy...

[cjwjames]

Top man Alan

Nice to know he was polishing his car ????