Seats - Advice Please

[Gary ZBJ]

Purchased some harnesses and a harness bar this weekend, and I realise that using the standard seats without harness holes is not ideal.

 

Therefore I am looking at the following seats, and was wondering what peoples views were? The car is my daily driver, although it is only a 15 minute journey, and I do 4 - 5 track days per year.

 

As far as I can tell, my sensibly priced options are

 

Corbeau LE-PRO £889.99 http://www.toys4cars.co.uk/index.php?main_...oducts_id=58989

 

Hangar111 £954.10 http://www.hangar111.com/ckshop.php?item=5...26category%3D62

 

Firstly, looking for peoples thoughts on the two seats and how they compare to the standard S2 seat which I have no problems with at all.

 

Secondly, anyone local to Corby that has either of these fitted, or anyone going to Bedford on the 13th with LOT? (I'm not, but its not to far a trip to avoid spending £1k on the wrong seats)

 

Cheers

 

Gary.

[richbk]

hi gary

 

what bar/harnesses have you bought?

 

i have sabelt 4 points and bar and they work fine with my standard seats, no rubbing etc?

 

although maybe heights a factor? im 6 3" so my shoulders are level / above cureve of the seat??

 

richbk

[FlyingExige]

General advice seems to be that a harness on normal seats is a 'no no'!

[richbk]

General advice seems to be that a harness on normal seats is a 'no no'!

 

 

why?

 

i can see the point if the seat is causing an obstruction in the passage of the belt over the shoulder and down to fix points, but if its not i dont see any problem??

 

astetically i agree it looks much better and more "race car", but as a functional item?

 

happy to be corrected btw, just intriuged?

 

richbk

[Martin R]

There has been a fair bit of discussion about the safety aspect of normal seats and harnesses. there was / is a train of thought that your shoulders may slip out in the event of a large accident. Seats with harness holes obviously hold you more securly at a lot bigger cost as well. As an aside the harness bars are different for each types of seats. The bar for normal seats have eyes in to allow for fixed upper mounting of the belts. The bars for harness hole seats have no such fixing as the belts wrap around and are not fixed as such HTH

[danwebster]

Personally, and I stress this is my personal opinion, I think its a load of cobblers.

 

Maybe if you drive around with the belts loose, but if you strap yourself in correctly I don't see how they can 'slip off'.

 

I certainly felt safer with my harness and standard seats than I did with seat belts.

[Martin R]

Personally, and I stress this is my personal opinion, I think its a load of cobblers.

 

Maybe if you drive around with the belts loose, but if you strap yourself in correctly I don't see how they can 'slip off'.

 

I certainly felt safer with my harness and standard seats than I did with seat belts.

 

Dan, i agree entirely. I had normal seats and harnesses on my old 111s and they seemed to do the job. I was only explaining the options and the for and against. You pay your money and make your choice

[danwebster]

Wasn't directed at you Martin....I too have seen the many discussions, many of them with a lot of contributions from seat retailers I might add!

[fentuz]

General advice seems to be that a harness on normal seats is a 'no no'!

 

 

I disagree... If it was really true, lotus wouldn't have sold elise with harness and Std seats...

 

If the harnesses are mounted, it's fine! If you find them too much on the side, cross the strappes behind the headrest as advised by Hangar111 and Luke(in their fitting guide line)

[Gary ZBJ]

I disagree... If it was really true, lotus wouldn't have sold elise with harness and Std seats...

 

That is interesting, I didn't realise Lotus did sell an elise like that?

 

I have the Schroth Profi II FE harnesses http://www.msar-safety.com/profi-ii-fe-lot...hand-p-111.html Not sure of the bar, as it was second hand, but it has the ability to bolt in the harnesses and I have the required kit to do that.

 

My concern is from the general information on web, which we all know that needs taken with a pinch of salt, but also the warning with the harnesses is quite specific

 

I guess the only solution is to fit the harnesses, pull them tight and see if my mind is at ease with how secure I feel, if not look at seats then. I must admit, if Lotus did sell a car with harnesses and standard seats then that makes me feel a lot better.

 

Cheers for the advice,

 

Gary.

ps, I am 5'10" so I think my shoulders will be below the corner of the seats, again will just see when I put the car together

[fentuz]

check the passenger seat

 

It is true it's not the "Best" configuration but it doesn'nt mean it ' s wrong.

 

We recommend that harnesses are crossed over behind the seat if used with standard seats.

 

http://www.hangar111.com/ckshop.php?item=2...26category%3D20

[Gary ZBJ]

I'll give it a go at the weekend and see how I get on

[dobbo]

IMHO, think about what's at risk here ! Simply trying them and getting them tight enough to be "comfortably reassuring" is NOT the same as knowing that you'll be OK in a big smash ! The thought of coming partially out of a seat due to inadequate belting-in is just frightening....

 

OK, normal seatbelts aren't really tight in normal use, but the inertia system stops you going too far in a crash and all 3 points are solidly mounted. With wrap-around harnesses and standard seats there is absolutely nothing to stop the belts sliding along the bar in the event of a big sideways force. If there are no harness holes in the seats, I would only fit bolted shoulder straps or, at the very least, cross them over behind the seat.

 

I wouldn't consider the option of cutting holes in seats either - I can't believe that some suppliers even suggest it. Seat designs are individually tested, and cutting holes (especially DIY ones) could easily destroy some crucial piece of strength in the seat.

 

Staying attached to the car is usually the best way to survive a big one, but staying attached and bouncing around through inadequate restraint can only make it worse.

 

As I said, just IMHO...

[Martin R]

As Chris says you should never use wrap around harnesses with standard seats. That is the reeason there are 2 types of harness bars. You must use the bars with fixed hole positions with standard seats.

[tstendall]

IMHO, think about what's at risk here ! Simply trying them and getting them tight enough to be "comfortably reassuring" is NOT the same as knowing that you'll be OK in a big smash ! The thought of coming partially out of a seat due to inadequate belting-in is just frightening....

 

OK, normal seatbelts aren't really tight in normal use, but the inertia system stops you going too far in a crash and all 3 points are solidly mounted. With wrap-around harnesses and standard seats there is absolutely nothing to stop the belts sliding along the bar in the event of a big sideways force. If there are no harness holes in the seats, I would only fit bolted shoulder straps or, at the very least, cross them over behind the seat.

 

I wouldn't consider the option of cutting holes in seats either - I can't believe that some suppliers even suggest it. Seat designs are individually tested, and cutting holes (especially DIY ones) could easily destroy some crucial piece of strength in the seat.

 

Staying attached to the car is usually the best way to survive a big one, but staying attached and bouncing around through inadequate restraint can only make it worse.

 

As I said, just IMHO...

 

Personally, I have to agree with this post. I don't think anyone can advise using a harness with standard seats unless they have done it AND been in a crash and survived without any problems. How many people can say that? Even then, wouldn't this affect insurance and the like?

 

tom